Pride in Hayes? I think 'pride' is the wrong emotion; gratitude is more appropriate.

The Free Dictionary definition of PRIDE:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pride
The above definition suggests a mix of meanings for 'pride', ranging from a rightful sense of achievement, to outright and unjustified arrogance.

When my family moved to Hayes we were very happy to have found a reasonably well balanced area providing better housing than we were accustomed to; good employment prospects, satisfactory education establishments; and happened to be within relatively easy reach of open countryside. We were pleased to be there, but since we were benefitting from the 'achievements' of others , there is no reason for my being proud of Hayes at that time. Grateful, YES, but proud – no.

When we moved to Hayes it was governed locally by the Hayes & Harlington Urban District Council (H&HUDC), within the County of Middlesex. Life in and around Hayes in those days was really quite pleasant. Employment was readily available for anybody who wanted to work, and the population tended not to outstrip the available housing. But again, as beneficiaries, gratitude was more in order than pride. During those early years the local politicians hadn't yet begun to overtly exhibit the dictatorial characteristics that have become the norm of today.

Then came the local authority shake-up that merged many local councils into very large and remote London Boroughs and large unitary councils that has resulted in the rapid decline in the quality of life over so much of what we continue to call Britain.

For many years, I, probably along with the vast majority of Brits, accepted what the political class were doing in our name to our country and local communities. Very slowly I began to wake up to what was really being done to us; and this is where any sense of pride becomes thoroughly negated. I cannot feel any sense of achievement, or pride, for not standing up sooner and earlier to the deceitful politics that has become the norm since the early 1970s. I do not feel any pride for having allowed myself to be so politically misled; so abused; and so thoroughly betrayed.

As our one-time contactable local councils disappeared, they were replaced with increasingly arrogant and relatively faceless bureaucratic pyramids of increasingly over-paid Common Purpose change agents. Successive UK Governments oversaw the merging of the UK into the European Union federal system of centralised control from Brussels, where now the very large local authorities effectively take their directives from foreign unelected Marxist Commissioners of the EU. Now the unitary councils and large boroughs are being further merged into covert EU regions, the same regional assemblies that the electorates rejected in referenda.

I am not proud for what has been done to us. I am not proud for having been so successfully deceived. I believe a sense of shame is in order at my own foolishness at being so readily deceived; as is my slowness to wakeup and speak out against the treachery that has, and continues to be perpetrated against us in the cause of LibLabCON politics. I grieve over the toxic political and economic mess that my grandchildren will have to endure.

For most of my time on this planet my life continued to improve from wartime poverty to relative luxury. Even when poor we used to enjoy a sense of optimism, there was something to look forward to;things did get better; but now that situation has rapidly changed to becoming close to despair for the future of Britain and her people. And while the truth of the situation is staring us in the face, the same untrustworthy political class continue to try and deceive us into believing that the same group of failed politicians have the answer. They do not have the answers because the underlying problems are not political, nor are they economic. The problems we are experiencing are spiritual; and the political class not only increasingly reject spiritual truth – they actually legislate against it. And when told the problems are spiritual the same politicians will laugh in your face.

For the current generation; although they have so much in the way of material benefits and gizmos, I fear they are facing horrors that many of them are ill-equipped to face. Even knowledge of the truth has largely been denied them, meaning that the difficulties they face will be all the more shocking and demanding. Common Sense has been replaced with Political Correctness; free speech is close to becoming history; free thinkers are labelled 'deniers'; ordinary Christian fundamentalists are viewed as 'non-violent domestic terrorists'; true science is replaced with consensus gobbledygook nonsense; normality has been inverted; truth is now a lie, and lies are the new truth; good has become evil, and evil is now the good.

Far from 'pride', I think a sense of gratitude is in order for the good times we can recall; and a sense of shame is also in order for allowing ourselves to have been so readily deceived.

Hi Westonman,

There is a lot to consider in what you have said later in your post, but your first definitions of pride quoted from the Free Dictionary, especially 1 and 3, need some thought because they seem to contradict each other. If someone behaves with dignity and has values to live by, they would not want to treat others with disdainful conduct and haughtiness. I have known some haughty people and not felt comfortable with them but would not say so because I would have felt that would be taking away my own dignity and sense of values to have done so.

Quote 2, I can, and would want to relate to.

Parental pride is an interesting definition which can be a continual quest for children growing up who have more favoured siblings and the quest can continue into adulthood. Therefore, the previous quote of taking pleasure in achievement and possessions can make somone even more proud if having parents who do not understand and are not proud. It does not mean that the pride creates a right to treat others with disdain.

I think that all those definitions show how peculiar our English language is and how it can cause great confusion on whether having pride is good or not.

The above definition suggests a mix of meanings for 'pride', ranging from a rightful sense of achievement, to outright and unjustified arrogance.

When my family moved to Hayes we were very happy to have found a reasonably well balanced area providing better housing than we were accustomed to; good employment prospects, satisfactory education establishments; and happened to be within relatively easy reach of open countryside. We were pleased to be there, but since we were benefitting from the 'achievements' of others , there is no reason for my being proud of Hayes at that time. Grateful, YES, but proud – no.

When we moved to Hayes it was governed locally by the Hayes & Harlington Urban District Council (H&HUDC), within the County of Middlesex. Life in and around Hayes in those days was really quite pleasant. Employment was readily available for anybody who wanted to work, and the population tended not to outstrip the available housing. But again, as beneficiaries, gratitude was more in order than pride. During those early years the local politicians hadn't yet begun to overtly exhibit the dictatorial characteristics that have become the norm of today.

Then came the local authority shake-up that merged many local councils into very large and remote London Boroughs and large unitary councils that has resulted in the rapid decline in the quality of life over so much of what we continue to call Britain.

For many years, I, probably along with the vast majority of Brits, accepted what the political class were doing in our name to our country and local communities. Very slowly I began to wake up to what was really being done to us; and this is where any sense of pride becomes thoroughly negated. I cannot feel any sense of achievement, or pride, for not standing up sooner and earlier to the deceitful politics that has become the norm since the early 1970s. I do not feel any pride for having allowed myself to be so politically misled; so abused; and so thoroughly betrayed.

As our one-time contactable local councils disappeared, they were replaced with increasingly arrogant and relatively faceless bureaucratic pyramids of increasingly over-paid Common Purpose change agents. Successive UK Governments oversaw the merging of the UK into the European Union federal system of centralised control from Brussels, where now the very large local authorities effectively take their directives from foreign unelected Marxist Commissioners of the EU. Now the unitary councils and large boroughs are being further merged into covert EU regions, the same regional assemblies that the electorates rejected in referenda.

I am not proud for what has been done to us. I am not proud for having been so successfully deceived. I believe a sense of shame is in order at my own foolishness at being so readily deceived; as is my slowness to wakeup and speak out against the treachery that has, and continues to be perpetrated against us in the cause of LibLabCON politics. I grieve over the toxic political and economic mess that my grandchildren will have to endure.

For most of my time on this planet my life continued to improve from wartime poverty to relative luxury. Even when poor we used to enjoy a sense of optimism, there was something to look forward to;things did get better; but now that situation has rapidly changed to becoming close to despair for the future of Britain and her people. And while the truth of the situation is staring us in the face, the same untrustworthy political class continue to try and deceive us into believing that the same group of failed politicians have the answer. They do not have the answers because the underlying problems are not political, nor are they economic. The problems we are experiencing are spiritual; and the political class not only increasingly reject spiritual truth – they actually legislate against it. And when told the problems are spiritual the same politicians will laugh in your face.

For the current generation; although they have so much in the way of material benefits and gizmos, I fear they are facing horrors that many of them are ill-equipped to face. Even knowledge of the truth has largely been denied them, meaning that the difficulties they face will be all the more shocking and demanding. Common Sense has been replaced with Political Correctness; free speech is close to becoming history; free thinkers are labelled 'deniers'; ordinary Christian fundamentalists are viewed as 'non-violent domestic terrorists'; true science is replaced with consensus gobbledygook nonsense; normality has been inverted; truth is now a lie, and lies are the new truth; good has become evil, and evil is now the good.

Far from 'pride', I think a sense of gratitude is in order for the good times we can recall; and a sense of shame is also in order for allowing ourselves to have been so readily deceived.[/quote

It is probably because I was born and bred in Hayes that I have an inner pride which doesn't really amount to gratitude as that is a different feeling. The opposite to pride is shame and I was not ashamed to be growing up in Hayes. It was home and didn't represent bad or evil.

Things did change when it became 'Hayes in the London Borough of Hillingdon' and the decline of the appearance of what was a really nice place would make anyone like myself who was born there not feel pride to be associated with parts of it now, in addition to the behaviour of some of the later residents who has given Hayes a disappointing reputation. The earlier pride doesn't go away and was built up from the experience of being there and how I was able to learn and mix with people I liked and who got on together in a community spirit. My feelings then are a mixture of pride and gratitude but for me pride is not the 'wrong' emotion and I am glad I have that with me.
A sense of pride can help people through tough events and bad experiences, I have learnt.

You say that to have been deceived causes a sense of shame for letting that happen, but surely it is those that deceive who should feel that shame. On a personal level, and not speaking politically, I know the feeling of being betrayed and those who betrayed have their conscience to live with, whereas I can be proud that I have not caused those people to feel worse than they must have already felt for their actions. I can relate to your words 'truth becomes lies' and' lies become truth'.

I feel more ashamed, actually, for the deceivers in life who cause suffering in any way and so, even though I speak on a different level to the above, I can't think that we should feel shame for 'letting ourselves be deceived'. Disappointment, maybe, but not shame.

Hi Marion. You are quite correct in saying that “those definitions show how peculiar our English language is”. I thought I had tried to cover that by saying, “The above definition suggests a mix of meanings for 'pride', ranging from a rightful sense of achievement, to outright and unjustified arrogance”. A rightful sense of achievement, and unjustified arrogance are poles apart, and contradictory; which I suggest agrees with what you are now saying.

I went on to say in my above post that the reasons for 'pride', (and here we are discussing our place of birth, and the quality of the place we were raised in) were nothing to do with the new-born, nor of the place where we are raised to the age of responsibility. Both the place of birth, and the place of being raised are benefits bestowed on the young by a previous generation – and therefore nothing to do with our personal 'pride' as in a sense of achievement (whichever definition of 'pride we wish to apply). I went on to say that gratitude and thanksgiving should perhaps be the response of an individual who has benefited from a good place of birth, and of being raised.

I have reasons for mentioning gratitude and thanksgiving, or the lack of, for received and perceived benefits; reasons that will become clearer in a later post here. Reasons that I believe have profound implications for where we are as a nation, a people, a society; morally, socially, politically, and economically. And I guarantee that the political class will not agree with me.

Hi Westonman

The English language must be very confusing for those trying to learn it as there are so many meanings to certain words as you found with the word 'pride'.
Thankyou for explaining more and looking forward to your next post. Today, too many years ago, I was born in Hayes, and so am thinking of Hayes as it was before all the negative changes.

I am sorry I couldn't join in any more since before Christmas but there was a lot of illness around.
Best Wishes
Marian